Content appropriateness in YA books?

[Falls Apart]

Okay, this is my first time posting on these forums (hi!) but I really need some advice on something . . . my WIP is geared towards high schoolers (maybe middle), and pacing/ages of characters would make it difficult for it to appeal to a different demographic. However, lately, people have been telling me that a lot of the content would be a turn-off for readers of that age group. Main problems being . . .

1. One of the characters (16 yrs) is kidnapped and forced to stay in a brothel. She gets out fairly quickly, and nothing actually happens (she kills a guy who's being overly forceful) and everything is mostly implied but the element of prostitution is still present, and discussed throughout the book. It's not presented as a good thing, though.

2. Another character (18 yrs) offers to get a girl he knows (15 yrs) out of a bad situation--essentially, arrest and execution--if she moves in with him. Although nothing is actually shown, it is very clear what is going on between them. Again, it's not presented as being a good thing on his part.

3. Probably the most problematic--one character's daughter (18 months) is threatened with torture (doesn't happen) and is eventually killed. You don't actually see her die (the father gets a box of her ashes sent to his house) so normally it wouldn't be that concerning, but the fact that she's an infant makes it worse. A lot of people (including adults) have told me that this would make them stop reading the book, or at least be problematic for them.

So, would these elements make the books inappropriate for the intended audience? I try to handle these things as tastefully as possible, but, the way I see it, bad things happen, and bad guys do bad things. Still, I'm wondering . . . any advice? Thanks!!!

[Guardian]

Probably the most problematic--one character's daughter (18 months) is threatened with torture (doesn't happen) and is eventually killed. You don't actually see her die (the father gets a box of her ashes sent to his house) so normally it wouldn't be that concerning, but the fact that she's an infant makes it worse. A lot of people (including adults) have told me that this would make them stop reading the book, or at least be problematic for them.

Now this is a problematic part. Take up the question, do you really need this part at all? I guess yes, otherwise you wouldn't take it into the story. But in your case I would meditate on some alternatives, how to make this less disturbing.

But my question is, is it really a YA novel? To me this novel sounds as a thriller instead (Even points 1 and 2). And thriller is is usally not YA (Character ages are not going to make a novel YA. The story does.).

1. Again, it's not presented as being a good thing on his part.
2. Although nothing is actually shown, it is very clear what is going on between them.

Then why they're there at all? It's the showing vs. telling part. If you're showing something in the story, it should be there completely, should be presented from one POV. If you're telling it, especially with a remote POV, it's becoming distant like if you would read a newspaper about an event. Right now the first two point sounds to me as some sort of meaningless backstory, such as: "It's happening, then it's not happening, then it's there, yet I'm not showing it.".

Try to focus your POV and also try to be clear with the genre that you're writing. I have that strong feeling that your story is not YA at all (Based on these three points.).

[cheekychook]

You've highlighted what I imagine are the more controversial parts of your novel, but you haven't told us much else. Exactly why do you think this would have a YA audience? (I can tell you right now this is in no way middle grade appropriate subject matter.) If you could tell us genre (is this set in the real world? fantasy? paranormal? dystopian?) and some of the actual plot, it might be easier to comment.

Just as an aside, while anything goes subject-wise in terms of fiction writing, be aware that there are many agents who specify that they will not even read any books where horrible things happen to children---it's a point many people have very strong feelings about---so be thorough with your agent research before you attempt to query agents with this project.

[polymath]

From what's given, I see characters experiencing sexual, physical, and emotional abuse and exploitation. They provide a situation for a setting, the third of setting's principal attributes along with time and place. What I don't see is a unifying theme. If the narrative theme explores the very real-world human condition of young adults' exposure to abuse and exploitation then age appropriateness would be trumped by a visionary revelation of how tough it really is to come of age with the added baggage of predators preying on young adults.

Plot is another matter. One of the fundamental characteristics of a plot is a change in fortune for the protagonist, from good to bad, bad to good, or bad to worse, etc. Considering the characters as given experience evil, bad, their outcomes would ideally be good. However, the kind of evil that exploits impressionable and gullible young adults isn't about to go away. Therefore, the outcome could be favorable for the individuals, but the overall message might be there's evil predators ever lurking about seeking vulnerable prey, beware.

[Falls Apart]

Right now the first two point sounds to me as some sort of meaningless backstory, such as: "It's happening, then it's not happening, then it's there, yet I'm not showing it.".

Hm I guess I phrased it wrong. What I meant was that objectionable elements aren't shoved in your face. It's definitely happening.

Exactly why do you think this would have a YA audience? (I can tell you right now this is in no way middle grade appropriate subject matter.) If you could tell us genre (is this set in the real world? fantasy? paranormal? dystopian?) and some of the actual plot, it might be easier to comment.

Yeah, I probably should have said more; I just didn't want to make the post too long :) I think it would appeal to a YA audience because it has faster pacing than most of the adult books I've read, and a lot of the conflicts I think would appeal more to teenagers. But I could be wrong. Also, since I've read more YA books than adult, I think that the style has rubbed off on me.
It's a dystopian book, and most of the content I've mentioned is more of a sub-plot than anything else. Basic story is about a one-world regime and five teenagers on both sides of the conflict in the events leading up to and succeeding a major catastrophe.

Thanks for the advice! :)

[Beethovenfan]

I think it would appeal to a YA audience because it has faster pacing than most of the adult books I've read, and a lot of the conflicts I think would appeal more to teenagers. But I could be wrong. Also, since I've read more YA books than adult, I think that the style has rubbed off on me.

What I think you should bear in mind is that it's the content of your story that really matters when talking about genre. Content-wise, this sounds adult to me. A fast paced book works fine for adults too. From what I've read from your first post, although you may not have been graphic in your descriptions, it could still leave graphic images from what has been left to the imagination (which can sometimes be worse than actually coming right out and saying it). Just my humble 2 cents worth. :)
Best of luck!

[steve]

Is your book a comedy? I can't tell from your descriptions.

There really is no such thing as appropriate or inappropriate books, just good and bad ones.

Write a good one.

[Sommer Leigh]

I'm going to agree with Steve here. It isn't about whether something is appropriate or not appropriate for YA. YA is a big world with lots of ages and maturity levels contained inside. There is no grid that says this subject is alright but this one is not, this one is acceptable so long as you leave out these words. It all comes down to how well the story is told. There are lots and lots of wonderful, extraordinary, and important YA books that have content that alone could be considered unacceptable for teenagers, but it is how the content is used that matters and changes everything.

That being said, YA books constantly come under fire from someone, somewhere who says the book is inappropriate for some specified age group. You could use one swear word and be the target somewhere, let alone using graphic accounts of hard to read topics. So be prepared for that level of questioning by someone somewhere if and when you get to publication.

[Falls Apart]

I think that I'll rework the part with the baby, although I'll probably still keep 1 and 2 in (the plot would have trouble progressing w/out them). Thanks for the advice!

[DelicatePrincess]

This is my first post, and I'm kind of a newbie, but I do read alot of YA books. What I see is a story about 5 teens learning to survive in a world gone to hell, narrowly escaping exploitation and having to make some tough decisions. I think it would appeal to older teens and I do see it as a YA book, albet a dark and edgy one (which I don't normally read.)

[Falls Apart]

What I see is a story about 5 teens learning to survive in a world gone to hell, narrowly escaping exploitation and having to make some tough decisions. I think it would appeal to older teens and I do see it as a YA book, albet a dark and edgy one

Yeah, that is pretty much the theme, and I guess it is pretty dark: the main characters are a pyrokinetic/pyromaniac failing at her resolution not to kill people, a single teenage father who's manipulated into doing awful things to protect his daughter, a petty theif/sort of prostitute, an arrogant, self-centered jerk who's really only redeemed in death, and an ex-assasin genius who's playing on both sides of a mind game . . . and those are the good guys. :) Maybe I like anti-heroes a bit too much.

[Fenris]

Maybe I like anti-heroes a bit too much.

Never worry about this. Their flaws are what make them human.

Now, in relation to your questions, I have to agree with the others: this is definitely not middle grade, and if it's truly YA it's certainly at the higher end of the age group, in with the darker and edgier stuff. But this isn't the problem, the problem is the issues within. The first two are...questionable, but not horrific depending on how you handle them. The third, on the other hand.... Now, I know you've said you'll rework it, so these are merely suggestions.

There's this thing tvtropes.com calls "Infant Immortality," named such because young children and babies either always survive or, in settings where it would be all too easy for them to die, are not present at all. This is because it's human nature--indeed, basic instinct--to feel the need to protect our young. Anyone who disagrees will be seen as heathen, a heretic, and generally frowned upon (to put it lightly). If you force an instance of infant mortality like this, people will NOT like it. If it's necessary to the story, I suppose there's nothing anyone but you can do about that. But I would tread very lightly to avoid triggering an avalanche. Even the scene of the child's ashes being delivered could be deemed over-the-top, since it's still an explicit mention of the child's death.

I think if you wanted to keep it, you'd have to ease the reader into it, like dropping casual signs of the scene's approach. Never state it outright, but hint at possibilities. That way it will soften the blow somewhat; readers will still be horrified, but they'll be able to reflect and say "Okay, I guess I saw that coming." It'll still be a turn-off for some, but perhaps not all. In addition, you might let the scene slide into the background, never actually showing it. It would still happen, but the blow might be softened even further if the reader is "not present" for it. Simply having the father reflecting on his feelings when the box was delivered, while staring at it on the shelf/mantle, might be a better approach. But it's not my story, so do what you think is best.

EDIT: If you're going for shock value, then by all means send the baby-in-a-box out of the blue. But readers will not thank you for it. Also, I hope you're being realistic with the aftermath in terms of suspension of disbelief. I'm assuming (strange powers aside, if they exist) that the father is an ordinary human, made of the same proverbial "stuff" as anyone else. So how would ordinary people react to being handed their baby's ashes out of the blue? How would you? Most people would go into deep shock. I'm not a psychologist, but I can comfortably say that an ordinary human being would not recover from this kind of thing quickly. Just another reason to be careful with this; that character (the father) would be out of the action for a while if he were emotionally human, so if you up and send him on his way shortly afterward it will be one disconnect after another on the readers' part.

[Falls Apart]

If you're going for shock value, then by all means send the baby-in-a-box out of the blue. But readers will not thank you for it. Also, I hope you're being realistic with the aftermath in terms of suspension of disbelief. I'm assuming (strange powers aside, if they exist) that the father is an ordinary human, made of the same proverbial "stuff" as anyone else. So how would ordinary people react to being handed their baby's ashes out of the blue? How would you? Most people would go into deep shock. I'm not a psychologist, but I can comfortably say that an ordinary human being would not recover from this kind of thing quickly. Just another reason to be careful with this; that character (the father) would be out of the action for a while if he were emotionally human, so if you up and send him on his way shortly afterward it will be one disconnect after another on the readers' part.

I am actually taking out the baby-in-a-box thing altogether, seeing as it is YA, and an infant dying--especially if the infant was killed--is probably not appropriate. In the original plan, though, the father was definitely going to react strongly to it, especially considering that he's already an emotionally unstable teenager, it basically drives him to the brink of suicide. I'm reworking it, though, so the baby survives but is still held as a hostage. Can't have my bad guys being too nice :)