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Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 3rd, 2012, 2:10 pm
by dios4vida
Beethovenfan wrote:
Sommer Leigh wrote:So, I've been reworking my first pinch point because it has always felt wrong and it felt like I was taking way too long to get to the midpoint twist (which I was. My word count is all screwed up.) And as I've been replotting and rewriting, I started getting this weird feeling that maybe what I'd written for my first pinch point is actually the midpoint twist. It comes up close to the right point in the word count, but the intent isn't there. It wasn't meant to be that important. And that is frustrating. So I'm trying to strip it down so it isn't so important and, at the same time, get to the midpoint faster.

When I decided to split my protagonist into two people and give them equal face time and equal importance, I had no idea how difficult it was going to be to get everyone to the right points in the story at the same time without going over word count. I don't think I'll write two points of view ever again because of it. I mean, I love the story, but I just want to throw it out there that I barely passed college algebra and if it weren't for Excel I wouldn't be able to do half the maths I do manage. I've had to build an excel spreadsheet to track my chapter word counts and throw up red flags when I've blown past critical moments in the story. First plot point ended up like at the 37% mark instead of the 25%. I've managed to cut enough word count to bring that down to 28%, but still.
Sommer, you're scaring me girl! That is a lot of math, none of which I do in my own writing. I wouldn't even no where to begin, which makes me wonder what else I don't know. But should. :shock:
She got most of this from Larry Brooks' Story Engineering. I had no idea about any of this before I read that book. It's a concept that floats around with a lot of different people, actually, but I think Brooks lays it out in the most accessible and easily applicable way. The book's only like $12 on Amazon (last time I checked) and it's worth every penny and more, in my opinion.

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 3rd, 2012, 2:15 pm
by Mark.W.Carson
I got story engineering. It was good, but Brandon Sanderson's classes were better :). I may have to finish Story Engineering. He kept on padding his word count with some ridiculous SPAM like pitch.

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 3rd, 2012, 2:29 pm
by dios4vida
Mark.W.Carson wrote:I got story engineering. It was good, but Brandon Sanderson's classes were better :). I may have to finish Story Engineering. He kept on padding his word count with some ridiculous SPAM like pitch.
Yeah, Brandon's classes were awesome. :)

I had a hard time with Story Engineering at first, because he did go on and on and on about how awesome this will be, once he tells you these awesome tips. But once you get into the chapters and the actual information, it's amazing. I learned more in the few days I read that book than 10 years of writing on my own. Hard to get there, but absolutely worth the effort.

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 3rd, 2012, 2:37 pm
by Sommer Leigh
dios4vida wrote:
Beethovenfan wrote: Sommer, you're scaring me girl! That is a lot of math, none of which I do in my own writing. I wouldn't even no where to begin, which makes me wonder what else I don't know. But should. :shock:
She got most of this from Larry Brooks' Story Engineering. I had no idea about any of this before I read that book. It's a concept that floats around with a lot of different people, actually, but I think Brooks lays it out in the most accessible and easily applicable way. The book's only like $12 on Amazon (last time I checked) and it's worth every penny and more, in my opinion.
*Larry Brooks Love!!!*

Brooks makes so much more sense to me than anything else, though I borrow structuring form other theories too, but primarily from Brooks.

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 3rd, 2012, 2:43 pm
by Sommer Leigh
Mark.W.Carson wrote:I don't know. For me, writing is such a weird and intimate thing, that it would be like using a spreadsheet for sex.

On an ENTIRELY different note. Sommer, now that I see you have come back a bit, and don't seem underwater, did you have a chance to look over the PM I sent you outlining my story? I was wondering what you thought, and if you had a general idea about what genre it fell into.
Writing isn't like that for me. It's not mystical or spiritual or anything like that. It's a job. I mean, it's a job I love, but it's a skill I do, if that makes any sense. I keep my writing life as organized as I do my regular every day job, otherwise I'd fear wandering aimlessly and wasting time on chapters and events that aren't meaningful. My biggest pet peeve in writing is actually getting off track and writing something I don't need.

I'm not really underwater, I've just reprioritized the end of my summer to not do online things and to do more writing things. So I've been MIA on Twitter and my blog and I have like three hundred e-mail I haven't answered yet. I will, I promise, I just haven't yet. The main reason I stop by here is because our spam problem is out of control these days.

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 3rd, 2012, 3:01 pm
by Mark.W.Carson
:: Waits Patiently :: :: Twiddles Thumbs ::

OK :).

It's not spiritual or anything, but it is personal stuff, and I do waste a lot of time on it, but I don't think I could be as creative as I have been without it. Much of what I did in the beginning I won't do again, because I was lost, and meandering. I may give Story Engineering another try. A lot of what I have been doing, though, I found was "The" or one of the right things to do in both Sanderson's and Brooks' books, so I stopped reading and kept writing.

I was told I have a natural ability at this, and I don't believe it. I think I picked up on stuff and it stuck to my subconscience. I am always willing to , and have the desire to get better.

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 3rd, 2012, 5:10 pm
by Sommer Leigh
Author R.A. Salvatore wrote one of the best responses to fan fiction today I've ever read. It's pretty much my opinion of it as well.

http://www.mediabistro.com/galleycat/r- ... -it_b55468

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 3rd, 2012, 7:32 pm
by trixie
I won't lie: Sommer's spreadsheet love is making me want to start a new one, but I know in my heart of hearts (what a dumb phrase, BTW) that I would use it only as an excuse to avoid writing my bridge.

What bridge, you ask?

I wrote a brand new section. I like to think of it as a liver transplant. I have the story (the body) and this new scene (the liver). I need to get the liver into the body. That's step one. Steps 2-infinity include circulation work, aka--making sure the existing story accepts the new scene.

This has been a good addition (who doesn't need another liver?), but I need to bridge the new scene to overall story at the back end. I have the front end done, the part that leads up to the new scene. But connecting these dots so I can continue on with the rest of the story is making me crazy(ier).

Also, trying to seriously limit my online time. Back to writing!

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 3rd, 2012, 7:53 pm
by Hillsy
This is why I hate writing (in a sense)

I do the same thing spreadsheet wise, but I do it almost exclusively after the fact (which Is why I find I write in neat 5-7K chapters, without even realising I do it). I don't think about the turning point or the mis-section rise of action or the descent into the 3rd act - I just write.....

....and now not putting any of this effort in and not re-jigging my character every 2nd draft or working which protag works for which scenario (and yeah the Sanderson thing where he split Dalinar made me really dispondant), makes me think I'm not thinking about the story enough and writing a load of formless, action driven drivel.

Gah - who'd be a writer, eh?!?!?!

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 3rd, 2012, 11:04 pm
by CharleeVale
If I made a spreadsheet, it would be a very beautiful spreadsheet. It would be pretty and color coded and such, but it wouldn't help me at all!

CV

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 4th, 2012, 6:48 am
by writersink
CharleeVale wrote:If I made a spreadsheet, it would be a very beautiful spreadsheet. It would be pretty and color coded and such, but it wouldn't help me at all!

CV
Exactly the same for me. I tried making one, but like most things I do it fizzled out when I realized I'm not the type of person who can be organized. It scares me a little. If I think everything has been planned in too much detail for me, I won't do it. I'm weird like that.

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 4th, 2012, 8:31 am
by Claudie
Sommer's spreadsheet makes me jealous, in part because I keep track of about the same things as she does but never took the time to do this. So I'm always highlighting chunks of texts to know how long they are. XD

Tricia: It's great to hear you're feeling better! Here, have confettis!

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 4th, 2012, 11:51 am
by trixie
Thanks, Claudie. Here, have a cupcake.

You know what?
CUPCAKES FOR EVERYONE!!

I've missed you guys so I baked. And by "baked" you do know I mean "bought from Cheeky" right?

My biggest challenges today include:
1. To not turn on the TV. If I do, I will get sucked into the time vortex that is the Olympics. I've watched far too much of them already. Great job, athletes. Congrats on all your accomplishments. I just can't watch or else I'll lose my day.
2. To monitor my online time. I might pull out some #1k1hr sprints later today/tonight. If anyone's around on Twitter, let me know if you're interested.

I'm going to run my errands. The sooner I get out of here, the sooner I can get home, put on my comfy writing clothes, and WRITE! (I'm just a little excited for my weekend, in case you can't tell...)

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 5th, 2012, 4:59 am
by writersink
My biggest challenges today include:
1. To not turn on the TV. If I do, I will get sucked into the time vortex that is the Olympics. I've watched far too much of them already. Great job, athletes. Congrats on all your accomplishments. I just can't watch or else I'll lose my day.
2. To monitor my online time. I might pull out some #1k1hr sprints later today/tonight. If anyone's around on Twitter, let me know if you're interested.
I've been sucked into the Olympics too, which is weird because I never normally watch them. What's your twitter username? I love 1k1hr sprints.

Re: The Coffee Shop - AUGUST

Posted: August 5th, 2012, 11:52 am
by trixie
Crap, sorry WriterSink! Bro called last night. His family was going to come through my town on their way home from vacation. Bottom line: I swapped last night's writing session for chores, and will spend today writing.

Here's my Twitter name: TL_Conway

I'm around all day today if anyone else is interested! Come one, come all!

ETA: Durrr... Sorry, just saw your twitter name in your sig file. Off to find you! (And no, I don't mean that to sound as creepy as it does!)